Maybe I am missing something here but just take a look at pillar at rear of driver door for GVW and max axle weights. BF has no say on that. There is also the issue of GCW which comes into play when towing. For the stock cut-away that number is 5-6000 above GVW.
BF often adds a stub to Ford's frame which will reduce allowable weight on the hitch, and just maybe the GCW thus allowable. One should never ever exceed the individual axle weights, nor should one exceed allowable hitch weight per Ford or BF. In the real world you will very likely not get to the max GVW or GCW, since some individual weight would be limiting. We BF owners typically are way below front axle limits and the rear often is close to or beyond being overloaded. Engine choice, whether the old big V8, one of the assorted diesels, or the V10, likely doesn't matter. It is either an E350 or an E450.
Finally, there is a dirty secret which involved both chassis builders and the RV builders prior to the late 90's. A lot of overloaded units were built with chassis folks looking the other way. The loading situation for a 1995 unit and a 2005 may be quite different. If you really want to be safe and not compromise durability, get individual wheel weights and do not overload even a single wheel.
End of rant and I do apologize if I have misundetstood this thread.
Ralph
Towing
Moderator: bfadmin
-
larihack
Wow. Looks like I stirred up a little conversation here. Well, this is what I got from Born Free: the hitch is not truly rated, but is good to 5000 towed weight. Both my mechanic and UHaul think the truck engine is good to 7500-10K. So, I am going with the tow dolly, will drive slow and anger those behind me, but I have never towed a car before so they will just have to pass me. Wish me luck!!
-
Ray
larihack, I think You have a good safe plan that you will be comfortable with - I believe that after a hour or so of towing you will find you kinda forget the thing is back there until you look in a mirror. When towing a mini van on my dolly I really didn't realize it was back there most the time - I usually drove about 65 MPH. Just remember you have something behind you when pulling into places, turning corners (my tow dolly would not turn as sharp as the BF would)
And don't turn down any dead end streets - lol
Its really not that bad - you just off load/unhook everything - turn it around - and re-hook up everything
Just kinda embarrassing cause you know everyone driving by knows what you did.
Have a great tip
And don't turn down any dead end streets - lol
Its really not that bad - you just off load/unhook everything - turn it around - and re-hook up everything
Just kinda embarrassing cause you know everyone driving by knows what you did.
Have a great tip
-
larihack
-
Ray
All - I think I am back to where I started - pulling 6K wouldn't bother me.
Again I talked to Ford - Yes they did look in their documentation
I talked to a frame guy (and he looked at it) - These guys fix frames and wrecks from people that did stupid stuff and used the equipment past the capabilities - They know frame construction and capabilities.
I talked to a hitch guy (and he looked at it) who manufactures and installs hitches up to HD industrial applications - he also fixes hitchs that have been used past there capabilities. He knows hitches hitch/frame transition and capabilities.
I am not worried about hitch/tongue/axel weigh - that can either be adjusted to within parameters or is theoretically non-existent in my applications.
So the only documented low limiting factor is the BF recommendation of 5K - which is not stated in my manual - It is stated that the hitch is not class rated. So honestly I dont know where BF is coming up with 5K since it is not rated.
Unless someone can find it in their manual, which so far nobody has said anything - the hitch and tow capability of the BF is not rated..
I don't want to exceed GCWR - but I can do the math on that
And I am really not concerned about GVWR because I have checked the weight on my loaded unit and can adjust my tongue weight if necessary
So to Sum it up - I would not have a issue pulling 6K - Forever? no I wouldnt do that
My recommendation to folks is not to do anything they are uncomfortable with no matter what the manuals or experts say - If you are unconformable pulling anything don't do it - other than that there is some gray area out there.
Maybe I should check into pulling the BF with the explorer?????? - That might solve the numbers issue - LOL
Again I talked to Ford - Yes they did look in their documentation
I talked to a frame guy (and he looked at it) - These guys fix frames and wrecks from people that did stupid stuff and used the equipment past the capabilities - They know frame construction and capabilities.
I talked to a hitch guy (and he looked at it) who manufactures and installs hitches up to HD industrial applications - he also fixes hitchs that have been used past there capabilities. He knows hitches hitch/frame transition and capabilities.
I am not worried about hitch/tongue/axel weigh - that can either be adjusted to within parameters or is theoretically non-existent in my applications.
So the only documented low limiting factor is the BF recommendation of 5K - which is not stated in my manual - It is stated that the hitch is not class rated. So honestly I dont know where BF is coming up with 5K since it is not rated.
Unless someone can find it in their manual, which so far nobody has said anything - the hitch and tow capability of the BF is not rated..
I don't want to exceed GCWR - but I can do the math on that
And I am really not concerned about GVWR because I have checked the weight on my loaded unit and can adjust my tongue weight if necessary
So to Sum it up - I would not have a issue pulling 6K - Forever? no I wouldnt do that
My recommendation to folks is not to do anything they are uncomfortable with no matter what the manuals or experts say - If you are unconformable pulling anything don't do it - other than that there is some gray area out there.
Maybe I should check into pulling the BF with the explorer?????? - That might solve the numbers issue - LOL
Forgive me, I just noticed you do have the PSD chassis. That gives me comfort in saying that the 6K you are going to tow will be easily handled, equivalent to my empty car hauler with which I have over 75K miles of towing with the same rig. I do tear my hitch (Class III) and had it rewelded which lasted for about 3 years. I replaced it last year with a Class IV which with the Hensley is rated at 10K capacity. I also have AirLift air springs, larger brakes and ceramic pads none of which you will need at that weight as long as you keep the hitch load below 500 lbs.
Finally the last thing to watch is the tires to make sure you do not exceed the load rating. My weight split is 3.5K on the front and 7K on the rear which means I need a 3.5K capable tire at a MINIMUM. Preferably a tire with moe which is why I went with LRGs
Finally the last thing to watch is the tires to make sure you do not exceed the load rating. My weight split is 3.5K on the front and 7K on the rear which means I need a 3.5K capable tire at a MINIMUM. Preferably a tire with moe which is why I went with LRGs
-
larihack
now its the hot water heater
Thank you all for all your helpful posts. I finally found the sticker in the closet that says I am good for about 14,500 lbs in the rig and up to 20,000 with a tow. My total tow load should be about 3800 lbs, so I think I am good. Will drive slow and let people throw me dirty looks. They aren't having as much fun as me and my family are going to be having!!
However, I know have another issue. Turned on the hot water heater for the first time, and no hot water. Let it sit for 3 hours. Still no hot water. Is there something more to be done other than flicking the switch under the sink? You would have thought that one of the many inspections I paid for would have picked up an non functional hot water heater wouldn't you?
However, I know have another issue. Turned on the hot water heater for the first time, and no hot water. Let it sit for 3 hours. Still no hot water. Is there something more to be done other than flicking the switch under the sink? You would have thought that one of the many inspections I paid for would have picked up an non functional hot water heater wouldn't you?
-
Ray
Could be allot of things - and depends what type of heater you have.
Lets assume you have a propane only heater like I do.
1# Make sure the LP is on. If the LP was off it may take a couple cycles trying to fire it up, there may be air in the lines.
2# and this should be #1 - you do have the tank full of water dont you? You have to flip the valves so it dosnt bypass the heater if you had it winterized - and BTW if that is the case you should clear the lines and run some fresh water through them before you flip the valves and fill the hot water heater.
Lets assume you have a propane only heater like I do.
1# Make sure the LP is on. If the LP was off it may take a couple cycles trying to fire it up, there may be air in the lines.
2# and this should be #1 - you do have the tank full of water dont you? You have to flip the valves so it dosnt bypass the heater if you had it winterized - and BTW if that is the case you should clear the lines and run some fresh water through them before you flip the valves and fill the hot water heater.
-
larihack
Well, I am getting less impressed with Camping Worlds' service dept. We paid $250 for a complete inspection that failed to detect a bad generator, so after having it for 4 days fixing up other things, we had to take her back to get the generator done. We also paid to have her dewinterized, and they apparently didn't switch the lines back so we didn't have water into/out of the hot water heater. Good thing I didn't leave the heater on. But we got her up and running now, I think, so I'm going to load her up and take off. Wish me luck!!
Oh, and sorry, Ray, if you got a few duplicate PMs. I thought that meant post message. I'm a rookie at this for sure!
Oh, and sorry, Ray, if you got a few duplicate PMs. I thought that meant post message. I'm a rookie at this for sure!
-
Ray
I am computer challenged !-
Ray
I would be very uncomfortable with any RV place that could not figure out any water heater by pass on any RV.
If they forgot it? OK, I guess that happens if the don't have some kind of Quality control.
And no Quality control would bother me also.
But it could be just one person, maybe a new person - But still Quality Control should have caught it.
The customer is not Quality Control, nor are we Tech instructors.
I pay good money to have people work on my stuff - I expect it right the first time.
The general saying concerning services - Good/Fast/Cheap - Pick any two, you are not going to get all three.
If they forgot it? OK, I guess that happens if the don't have some kind of Quality control.
And no Quality control would bother me also.
But it could be just one person, maybe a new person - But still Quality Control should have caught it.
The customer is not Quality Control, nor are we Tech instructors.
I pay good money to have people work on my stuff - I expect it right the first time.
The general saying concerning services - Good/Fast/Cheap - Pick any two, you are not going to get all three.
-
Ray
I understand it - But I guaranty you that I can figure out any hot water by pass on any RV that was ever built. And I am not a RV tech.
I know that is a broad statement but its just very simple pluming and valves.
And my point is that good places have quality control, check lists, final inspections, oversight.
Its pretty obvious they didnt see if the water heater would even work after they de-winterized the unit.
They probably put the laborer on the job cause it was so simple, and then had no quality control.
And boy do I have stories on that (several) - in fact I am headed back down to a front end alignment place this afternoon cause I had them put on a steering stabilizer (they sell them) - When they were done they told me they didn't like it cause it drove funny - I looked at it and went back in and told them they put it on backwards, I waited another 1 1/2 (they had to go to lunch) for them to get it on half right, I looked at it again and the one bracket was still wrong but I didn't have time to wait around that day. They told me they didn't have their regular guy install it cause it was a easy install.
There is definitely a reason that some people in this country make no more than minimum wage - and some are very lucky to get that.
I know that is a broad statement but its just very simple pluming and valves.
And my point is that good places have quality control, check lists, final inspections, oversight.
Its pretty obvious they didnt see if the water heater would even work after they de-winterized the unit.
They probably put the laborer on the job cause it was so simple, and then had no quality control.
And boy do I have stories on that (several) - in fact I am headed back down to a front end alignment place this afternoon cause I had them put on a steering stabilizer (they sell them) - When they were done they told me they didn't like it cause it drove funny - I looked at it and went back in and told them they put it on backwards, I waited another 1 1/2 (they had to go to lunch) for them to get it on half right, I looked at it again and the one bracket was still wrong but I didn't have time to wait around that day. They told me they didn't have their regular guy install it cause it was a easy install.
There is definitely a reason that some people in this country make no more than minimum wage - and some are very lucky to get that.
-
Ray
Well its one of the bigger ones here, been here for years and allot of people refer them.
Actually they pissed me off about 10 years ago cause of how they figured labor rates and I haven't been back till now. This time the place that I have been using were booked up for several weeks - they do mainly the big rigs, straightening frames ect. So I decided to give this place another try. I realize places, management, ect do change.
I guess I wont be going back there again except for this afternoon - again no quality control - it should be checked and double checked on the way out the door. I dont really care if they make it right - they should have done it right the first time - very easy task.
Actually I tell service providers I have a simple rating system.
1 - I go out of my way to tell everyone how bad they are
2 - If asked, I will tell I wasn't satisfied
3 - No comment either way
4 - If asked, I will tell I was satisfied
5 - I go out of my way to tell everyone how good they are
Actually they pissed me off about 10 years ago cause of how they figured labor rates and I haven't been back till now. This time the place that I have been using were booked up for several weeks - they do mainly the big rigs, straightening frames ect. So I decided to give this place another try. I realize places, management, ect do change.
I guess I wont be going back there again except for this afternoon - again no quality control - it should be checked and double checked on the way out the door. I dont really care if they make it right - they should have done it right the first time - very easy task.
Actually I tell service providers I have a simple rating system.
1 - I go out of my way to tell everyone how bad they are
2 - If asked, I will tell I wasn't satisfied
3 - No comment either way
4 - If asked, I will tell I was satisfied
5 - I go out of my way to tell everyone how good they are